Pai Gow Table
Pai Gow Poker is spread at over 60 Las Vegas casinos. There are several variants dealt, even within the same casino. There are several bets available at a Las Vegas Pai Gow Poker table. The main bet has a minimum of at least $5, depending on the casino. Side bets can often be made for $1 or $5. The player and dealer start with seven cards. Shop Poker Tables. Customizable Poker Tables; Folding Poker Tables. For Pai Gow Poker Pai Gow Dice (Set of 3) Competitor Price: $14.50. Your Price: $11.99. These Pai Gow Cups come with matching lids. Our Aluminum Pai Gow Cup features a high gloss silver finish and measures 2-1/2' inches tall and 3-1/8' across the top (with lid). The Anodized Pai Gow Cup features a matt Gold Finish and measures 2-1/2' tall and approximately 3-1/4' across the top (with lid).
The system in use is Shufflemaster Inc.'s 'I-deal' system, and it is used on their Fortune Pai Gow product.
Yes, it is true, the table system knows what each player's hand packet is, and also uses a random number generator to determine the start position of the deal, essentially knowing what every position player - including the dealer - has. This is how it knows how to set each position hand to the house way, if a player asks. It also instructs the dealer how to set is hand to the approved house way. This is also why player banking or the dragon hand aren't allowed, - because it disorientates the table computer system has to which position is holding what cards for this hand-setting assist.
However, there is some pushback on the system, namely:
1. Many players become annoyed or infuriated when they see their hand being known pre-deal, then displayed by the table computer system upon a hand setting recommendation. Seeing the cards that we are holding in our hand displayed on the system when asked makes us say, 'the Table computer KNEW my cards going INTO the deal - and is displaying it now! Huh??!!'
2. If, - in a very rare and unlikely scenario, the table software is 'gaffed' or illegally modified, the modified computer code could possibly instruct the system to ship a bonus hand of a Four of a kind or better to the dealer's position - or to a specific player's position. ['Where's the USB port on this thing?!'] Please note that the system does not 'Arrange' hands, as it really shuffles legitimately within the shuffler, it's just that the system knows the composition of each hand after the internal shuffle is done, and after the random number generator determines the deal, and so does NOT say
Pai Gow Practice
'who gets what hand.' In defense of this system, also note that the random number generator is disconnected from the database result of the deck shuffle, so that the random number generates the starting position of the deal without knowledge or interest in a random fashion, THEN later is instructed of 'who has what,' so that it can assist in hand setting, if needed. This is very much like a Video Poker machine or slot machine, where the results are known by the system [as the hand is already determined before it is played out by the player(s)], - but is allowed to happen in a fair and random fashion, - and is only tracked to assist hand-setting, and to prevent the introduction of 'mucked cards' into play through after-the-fact verification.3. Players frequently feel uncomfortable playing a live card game where the play results were actually pre-known and resolved by the system before the play of the hand itself - but after (and not known by the database) until after the random number generator and a random shuffle is completed. The random number generator gives both a random 'start deal position' - as well as a random shuffle itself, and so are not influenced. The system doesn't know and doesn't influence anything, but tracks the full deal only after the random shuffle and the random starting position, - and after deal has begun, - exactly the same way as on all slot and VP machines, but on a table game. That's all it is about these machines.
4. Still, many Pai Gow players insist on playing at tables where physical dice are used to determine the start position, and some casinos use this way on this request. In these cases, there is no display console on the table, and a dice shaker determines the random start position, or the display is covered, and a dice shaker is used.
5. The I-deal system has been examined for fair play usage by Nevada Gaming and other gaming jurisdictions, just as the slot machine systems are verified. If you know and trust slot or VP play, you should by all means have confidence in the I-deal system. You should also have trust in it if you just play tables games also.
4. Still, many Pai Gow players insist on playing at tables where physical dice are used to determine the start position, and some casinos use this way on this request. In these cases, there is no display console on the table, and a dice shaker determines the random start position, or the display is covered, and a dice shaker is used.
Why can't dice always be used?Instead of an RNG displaying the starting position, the dealer should use the dice, then enter the result.
The hand-setting routine would still be able to set the dealer's hand.
The result is, although the system would know all the hands in advance, there is no way it could know who is getting which hand, so no player paranoia about the system rigging the dealer's hand.
Dice are used heavily, and are trusted.
Actually, there are some 'touch screen' third-party Random number displays in use, not connected to the I-deal system, or to any shufflers.
We used them at Fiesta Henderson with Galaxy Gaming's 'Emperor's Challenge' Pai Gow in 2009, and they worked well.
But the dice are so easy to use, and the players totally trust them, that we use them on EZ Pai Gow. The Asian players especially like the usage of Asian dice and shaker.
There is currently no commercial mechanism to connect the 'starting hand' number result from either the dice or to a third-party independent Number generator on the I-deal hand setting display, - simply because Pai Gow hands are not difficult to set for a poker or Pai Gow dealer.
Dealing Pai Gow is very much like Dealing Blackjack or Three-Card Poker: Easy!
The dealer just looks at his hand and sets it (if knowing poker), and done. One or Two break-in shifts dealing it, and it is mastered. Slower game, anyway. If a dealer cannot quickly help a player to set his own hand by the house way, then he might have trouble setting his own hand. This is rare, and he's taken off the game.
Now dealing Craps on a jammed up table is often very nasty, THAT needs a TCS Huxley kind of assist.
And 'house paranoia' is prevelant in many many players, so dice shaker usage or a third-party RNG works out very well, and just as quick with all dealers. But I like the I-deal RNG display.
Shit, if you need a computer to tell you how to set a card hand, you should not be dealing....there are very, very few 'Blackjack only' dealers with more than two months of dealing experience..
But the dice are so easy to use, and the players totally trust them, that we use them on EZ Pai Gow. The Asian players especially like the usage of Asian dice and shaker.
For those that don't know, Asian dice have a different look. This picture is from the Wikipedia - Dice page, showing standard board game dice, Asian dice, and craps dice.Pai Gow Tables Vegas
There is currently no commercial mechanism to connect the 'starting hand' number result from either the dice or to a third-party independent Number generator on the I-deal hand setting display,
It seems that it should not be too much trouble to add a keypad for this.Dealing Pai Gow is very much like Dealing Blackjack or Three-Card Poker: Easy!
The dealer just looks at his hand and sets it (if knowing poker), and done. One or Two break-in shifts dealing it, and it is mastered. Slower game, anyway. If a dealer cannot quickly help a player to set his own hand by the house way, then he might have trouble setting his own hand. This is rare, and he's taken off the game.
I thought it was mentioned in another thread that the system tells the dealer how to set the hand. Very useful for break-in dealers.
That brought on the discussion that, although typical house ways are easy to set, ideal house ways would have to many minor exceptions - exceptions that are too hard to remember and therefore left out. These exceptions would be easily incorporated into a computer that tells the dealer how to set the hand.
Dan -
I'm not really arguing with you. I just think that if there is player paranoia, then it's easily eliminated by using dice, and adding an interface to allow the dealer to enter the dice result - after the cards are dealt.
If you agree, then you're in a far better position than the rest of us, to suggest it to ShuffleMaster or other Powers-That-Be.
I can't find anything to disagree with you about, but ou're overlooking a rather simple amtter: trust.
If the player can see the shuffle and the dice, she knows everything is random. It is when you hide something, or give out information, that mistrust can arise. But then I imagine that happened when automated shufflers replaced hand shuffling, too. So maybe it's just a matter of time.
And naturally there are people who will believe the game is fixed even if everything is out in the open. But you can't argue with such people.
Dealing Pai Gow is very much like Dealing Blackjack or Three-Card Poker: Easy!
The dealer just looks at his hand and sets it (if knowing poker), and done. One or Two break-in shifts dealing it, and it is mastered. Slower game, anyway. If a dealer cannot quickly help a player to set his own hand by the house way, then he might have trouble
I know you are far more qualified than I in this matter, but I must disagree with these statements. I believe that dealing PG poker is considerably more challenging than blackjack. One of the reasons I enjoy playing PG poker is that i have found the dealers to be more competent and experienced. It seems this also tends to make them more personable and entertaining. I think that understanding the house way in PG poker is more difficult than remembering whether to stand or hit on a soft 17. A blackjack dealer doesn't even need to bother with splitting and doubling strategies. Plus, I am frequently impressed with the PG poker dealers' ability to calculate the 5% commission on complicated bets, and make appropriate change.
I am concerned that the introduction of computers that set the dealer's hand, as well as commission-free games, will eliminate the need for competent, experienced dealers. This would significantly decrease my enjoyment of the game.
Administrator
For the record, I trust the system, but can easily see why paranoia exists.
I agree. Personally, I would file the distrust of card readers under the usual hysteria every time a new piece of technology comes out. This too shall pass.
It seems to me that if someone is suspicious of the integrity of casinos that use card readers, it is not necessarily due to suspecting that they are controlling what cards are dealt to whom.
I have the impression that if a player (or dealer) knew the opponent's cards/tiles, that person might sometimes be able to improve his/her chances by setting the hand differently from the usual way -- setting it to perform best in opposition to the opponent's specific cards rather than against cards in general. If a computer knows what cards are dealt to everyone and is telling the dealer how to set the house hand, it certainly seems possible for the computer to take advantage of that information in making the decision. It would be improper, but it seems possible.
Did I misunderstand something here? Was this discussed above and I just overlooked it?
| Origin | United States |
|---|---|
| Players | 2–7 |
| Deck | French |
| Play | Clockwise |
| Card rank (highest first) | A K Q J 10 9 8 7 6 5 4 3 2 |
| Random chance | High |
| Related games | |
| Chinese poker | |
Pai gow poker (also called double-hand poker) is a version of pai gow that is played with playing cards, instead of traditional pai gow's Chinese dominoes. The game of pai gow poker was created in 1985 in the United States by Sam Torosian, owner of the Bell Card Club.[1]
The game is played with a standard 52-card deck, plus a single joker. It is played on a table set for six players, plus the dealer. Each player attempts to defeat the banker (who may be the casino dealer, one of the other players at the table, or a player acting in tandem with the dealer as co-bankers).[2]
Winning condition[edit]
The object of pai gow poker is to create a five-card poker hand and a two-card poker hand from seven cards that beat both of the bank's hands. The five-card hand's rank must exceed that of the two-card hand, and it is for this reason that the two-card hand is often called the hand 'in front', 'on top', 'hair', or the 'small', 'minor', or 'low' hand. The five-card hand is called the hand 'behind', or the 'bottom', 'high', or 'big', as they are placed that way in front of the player, when the player is done setting them.
Deals[edit]
The cards are shuffled, and then dealt to the table in seven face-down piles of seven cards per pile. Four cards are unused regardless of the number of people playing.
Betting positions are assigned a number from 1 to 7, starting with whichever player is acting as banker that hand, and counting counter-clockwise around the table. A number from 1 to 7 is randomly chosen (either electronically or manually with dice), then the deal begins with the corresponding position and proceeds counter-clockwise. One common way of using dice to determine the dealer starting number is to roll three six-sided dice, and then count betting spots clockwise from the first position until the number on the dice is reached.
If a player is not sitting on a particular spot, the hand is still assigned, but then placed on the discard pile with the four unused cards. In some casinos, such as the Golden Nugget and Palms in Las Vegas, Nevada, an extra 'dragon hand' is dealt if a seat is vacant. After all players have set their original hand they are asked in turn if they would like to place another bet to play the dragon hand. Generally the bet on the dragon hand can be the table minimum up to the amount the player bet on their original hand. The first player to accept the dragon hand receives it; this player is effectively playing two separate hands. Rules vary from casino to casino, but generally the dealer turns over the dragon hand and sets it using the house way. This is because the player has already seen the seven cards of their original hand, which could affect the way they would set the dragon hand.
Hand rankings[edit]
The only two-card hands are one pair and high cards.
Five-card hands use standard poker hand rankings with one exception: in most casinos, the 'wheel' (the hand A-2-3-4-5) is the second-highest straight. At most casinos in California and Michigan this rule doesn't apply, and A-2-3-4-5 is the lowest possible straight.
The joker plays as a bug, that is, in the five-card hand it can be used to complete a straight or flush if possible; otherwise it is an ace. In the two-card hand it always plays as an ace, except in several southern Californian casinos where the joker is wild.
Win reckoning[edit]
If each of the player's hands beats each of the banker's corresponding hands, then he wins the bet. If only one of his hands beats the banker then he pushes (ties) in which case neither he nor the banker wins the bet. If both of his hands lose to the banker then he loses.
On each hand, ties go to the banker (for example, if a player's five-card hand loses to the banker and his two-card hand ties the banker then the player loses); this gives the banker a small advantage. If the player fouls his hand, meaning that his two-card hand outranks his five-card hand, or that there are an incorrect number of cards in each hand, there will usually be a penalty: either re-arrangement of the hand according to house rules or forfeiture of the hand.
In casino-banked games, the banker is generally required to set his hand in a pre-specified manner, called the 'house way', so that the dealer does not have to implement any strategy in order to beat the players. When a player is banking, he is free to set the hand however he chooses; however, players have the option of 'co-banking' with the house, and if this option is chosen then the player's hand must also be set in the house way.
California casinos typically charge a flat fee per hand (such as 5 cents or one dollar) to play, win or lose. Other casinos take a 5% commission out of the winnings, which is usually known as the rake.[3]
Variants[edit]
There are a number of variations of Pai Gow poker that are popular in casinos today. These variations were mainly formulated in 2004 through 2009. Pai Gow Mania was the first variation to be created which allows for two side bets instead of the traditional one side bet per hand. Fortune Pai Gow is another variation which allows players to make a side bet on a poker hand ranking of three-of-a-kind or better, one of the most popular variations. Similar is Emperors Challenge, which also allows a side bet on a seven-card pai gow (no hand). Shuffle Master introduced a variation of the game in 2006, adding a progressive jackpot side bet, named Progressive Fortune Pai Gow. Part or all of the jackpot may be won by placing a side bet and landing one of the hands specified on the payout table; a combined seven-card straight flush wins the entire jackpot.[4]
Advantage play[edit]
Advantage play refers to legal methods used to gain an advantage while gambling. In pai gow poker, a player may be able to gain an advantage in certain circumstances by banking as often as possible, taking advantage of unskilled players while banking, and dealer errors when not banking.[3]
History[edit]
Sam Torosian, owner of the Bell Card Club in Los Angeles, invented the game of Pai Gow Poker in 1985. The idea for the game came to Torosian after being told about the game Pusoy by an elderly Filipino customer. He figured that the 13-card game with players arranging three hands would be too slow, but a simplified two-hand version with only seven cards would be faster and easier for players to learn. The game quickly became popular and by the late 1980s was being played on the Las Vegas Strip, and eventually worldwide. Torosian famously failed to patent the game he invented after being given bad advice by an attorney he consulted, and noted poker author Mike Caro, both of whom told him that the game was not patentable.[1]
See also[edit]
References[edit]
- ^ abRichard Marosi (3 November 2002). 'Casino Boss Can't Cash In on Game He Developed'. Los Angeles Times. Retrieved 21 December 2016.
- ^Michael Shackleford. 'Pai Gow Poker'. The Wizard of Odds. Retrieved 21 December 2016.
- ^ abWong, Stanford (1993). Optimal strategy for Pai Gow Poker. La Jolla, CA.: Pie Yee Press. ISBN978-0935926170.
- ^'Pai Gow Poker Variants'. Play Pai Gow Now. Retrieved 21 December 2016.